Haplogroup G2a Project
                              DNA Results and Groupings

                    G2a1a persons with origins outside the Caucasus Mountains region


The most characteristic value for G2a1a men is 10 for marker DYS392.  So far all known G2a1a persons
have theis value.  In available samples, G2a1a men account for most of the G persons with
a value of 10 for DYS392.  So the finding alone cannot predict who is G2a1a, but the presence of a value of 10
should raise a red flag.  Of lesser importance, all known G2a1a persons also have a value of 12 at marker
DYS425, a slowly mutating marker that has some variability.   In addition, researcher Thomas Krahn has
suggested that marker DYF411 may have some value in identifying G2a1a persons.  DYS392 is available
in the basic marker panel offered by most genealogy DNA labs.  DYS 425 is a little more difficult to obtain, but most
of the samples available to us with this value are in markers 38-67 of a panel of tests offered by Family Tree DNA.
Marker DYF411 is a special order item, and not enough data are currently available to offer any useful
information about it.

Some G2a1a persons can share some oddities of interest in some marker values if they have a relatively close
genetic distance.

A close genetic distance will be exemplified in relatively few marker value mismatches between two compared
samples.  In addition, we have used special DNA software (Fluxus) to produce phylogenetic diagrams using
67-marker samples.  Using 67 markers, these diagrams, which give extra weight to the slower-
mutating markers, have been relatively successful in showing correct relationships.  The clustering of men on the
diagrams because of closer relationships allows us to identify persons who are likely G2a1a but lack special
testing for G2a1a.  The diagrams also suggest who should compose a subgroup due to their clustered presence
on a distinct separate branch on the diagram.  The men here with 67 markers appear on the same branch in the diagram,
but the G2a1a men with a more distant ancestor are on different branches.

Persons who are G2a1a are confirmed as such by special SNP testing.  Persons who are G will all be
positive for the M201 SNP.  In addition, those positive for P287 are G2, and those also positive for P15 are G2a.
The P287 SNP is a rather recently identified SNP, and most of our samples were not tested for it.  However,
anyone who is P15+ will necessarily be P287+.   There are two further tests to bring the subcategorization
down to G2a1a.  First P16+ indicates G2a1, and P18+ indicates G2a1a.  However, the testing history of
P16 and P18 have been rather stormy and murky.  It is my opinion that all the men on this page are G2a1a
though some have had results which showed P16+ but negative for P18.  And one G2a1a man was found
negative for P18 at one lab, but positive for it at another lab.  Another who seems to have similar marker values
to the men on this page was found negative for P16.

In 2007, researcher Thomas Krahn announced some problems with the SNPs themselves that may cause persons
who should be positive to lack the changes on the DNA that would be expected.
http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/GENEALOGY-DNA/2007-07/1185576938
For a time Family Tree DNA removed P16 and P18 from its available tests.  But apparently Krahn was not
able to persuade other labs to follow suit, and the tests were restored.  A SNP should have as a
characteristic an inability to be lost, but Krahn's research indicates P16 and P18 are located on a part
of the chromosome where changes can occur.  Despite the deficiencies of P16 and P18 testing, those men
who are found positive for them provide valuable information.

The reason the men here are all considered G2a1a even if -- in a few cases -- they were found negative for
P18 relates to the fact that logically they should be P18+.   They are close enough genetically to proven P18+ persons
based on marker values that the SNP results should show P18+.  With more samples, it can be better determined
whether all these men are G2a1a (P18+) or whether instead there truly are men who are just P16+.

Tentatively it seems possible to identify two subgroups here.  The first is objectively identified by YCA values of
19, 21 and origins in eastern Europe.  The second is objectively identified by YCA values of 21,21 and also
DYS19 value of 16, and the fact that they have a strong Ashkenazi Jewish component.  All the remaining men on this
page seem to have YCA values of 20,21 though half the available samples have not been tested for this marker.  In fact,
the men in this third grouping on this page mostly have only 12 markers, severely handicapping our ability to
identify any clustering.  All the differences among these men presently involve the faster-mutating markers which are not
reliable in establishing relationships.  So none of the these differences in samples have been highlighted.  Note in the final
group on this page that half the samples are from two surname projects, and only one sample from each surname
grouping is generally useful in comparing all the miscellaneous persons to determine clustering.

Several marker values from research studies are shown below in italics.  These markers were not tested, but
the italizicized presumed values entered are either highly predictable or found in all G persons.  The research study
mentioned below is the study by Cinnioglu et al.  The YCC samples respresent those used by the Y-Chromosome
Consortium to establish the categories of what is now called G2a1 and G2a1a based on P16 and P18
findings. The YHRD database is a public database of samples collected from around the world as submitted by
scientists.  Research study # 2 is  Pierre Zalloua et al., "Y-Chromosomal Diversity in Lebanon Is Structured by
Recent Events
" American Journal of Human Genetics, 2008, vol 82(4), pp 873-82.  Research study # 3 is  
Pierre Zalloua et al., "Identifying Genetic Traces of Historical Expansions: Phoenician Footprints in the
Mediterranean
, American Journal of Human Genetics, 2008, vol 83(5), pp 633-42.  Research Study # 4 is
Mirvat El Sibai et al., "Geographical Structure of the Y-Chromosomal Genetic Landscape of the Levant: A
Coastal Inland Contrast," Annals of Human Genetics , 2009. 

One lab found Moody negative for P18, and another found him positive.

The YHRD database is a public database of samples collected from around the world as submitted by scientists. 
In a few samples the values in italics are only predicted, but are highly predictable.  The Sorenson database
consists of samples collected without charge mostly in the U.S. but has some from isolated locations.

For information on what is known of the origins of this grouping here and migrations and time
relationships to other G groupings link to the migration-time page .


Recommended additional deep ancestry testing for men here with the interest and funds for this:

Because there are so few G2a1a samples, upgrade to Family Tree DNA's 67 markers is always very useful in
determining proper relationships and for time calculations to common ancestors.  For deep ancestry purposes
only one person within a surname project needs the full 67 markers.  Additional testing within surname projects
might be indicated for more recent comparisons.

At Family Tree DNA for those tested there, in the haplotree section of a G2a1a person's results page is listed 
also a deep clade SNP test to order if he has not already been confirmed as G2a1 or G2a1a.   Until more men
below have SNP testing, it is not possible to suggest SNP testing is unneeded.  However, if one has 25 or
more markers tested and one's marker values are very close to someone already tested, it is likely the SNP
test will be (or should be) exactly the same.  This is especially true in the Jewish grouping below where the
common ancestor is relatively recent.
  



Results


1. Eastern European subgroup with YCA=19,21 

                                                                                                                                     Marker designations in blue

Kit No. Surname Ancestral.origin
 
Haplo
Code
 
YSearch
Link
393 390 19
(394)
391 385
a
385
b
426 388 439 389
i
392 389
ii
458 459
a
459
b
455 454 447 437 448 449 464
a
464
b
464
c
464
d
464
e
464
f
460 GATA
H4
YCA
IIa
YCA
IIb
456 607 576 570 CDY
a
CDY
b
442 438 531 578 395
S1a
395
S1b
590 537 641 472 406
S1
511 425 413
a
413
b
557 594 436 490 534 450 444 481 520 446 617 568 487 572 640 492 565 441 461 463 445 452 YGATA
A10
YGATA
H4.1
462 GGAAT
1807
635
N15079 
Sloan
Ukraine
MUCH
VVHWJ
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 13 11 10 28 17 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 29 13 13 15 15 10 10 19 21 15 15 15 19 36 37 12 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 12 10 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 15 8 12 21 22 16 13 12 13 10 11 11 13
 
SorensonDB anonymous
Kyrgyzstan
X
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 12 11 10 27 19 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 28 13 13 14 14 10 19 21 15 12 10 1\3 15 14 12 22 10 26 12 11 12 11 21
94200
Barabas
Hungary
GENL
RVB47
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 12 11 10 27 18 9 9 11 11 26 16 21 30 13 13 14 14 10 10 19 21 15 15 15 19 38 38 12 10
109761
Szekely
Hungary
GENL
SD4UU
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 11 11 10 28 16 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 19 21 15 15 16 19 39 40 12 10
94206
Szentes
Hungary
X
ZDVM9
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 12 11 10 28 18 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 19 21 15 15 15 19 39 39 12 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 12 11 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 15 8 13 21 22 16 13 11 13 10 11 11 12
16439
Baca*
CzechRepub
PART
T723Z
14 22 15 10 16 16 11 12 12 11 10 28 10
 
1 YHRD sample
Budapest,
Hungary
X
 
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 11 10 28
 
1 YHRD
sample
MiercueaCiuc
Romania
X
 
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 11 10 28
 
1 YHRD sample
Leipzig Germany
X
 
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 11 10 28
 
1 YHRD sample
Nowytorg Poland
X
 
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 11 10 28
 
1 YHRD sample
Wroclaw Poland
X
 
14 22 15 10 15 17 11 12 12 11 10 28 17 15 10 10 21


2. A partly Ashkenazi Jewish subgroup mostly YCA=21,21 and DYS19=16

                                                                                                                                     Marker designations in blue

Kit No. Surname Ancestral.origin
 
Haplo
Code
 
YSearch
Link
393 390 19
(394)
391 385
a
385
b
426 388 439 389
i
392 389
ii
458 459
a
459
b
455 454 447 437 448 449 464
a
464
b
464
c
464
d
464
e
464
f
460 GATA
H4
YCA
IIa
YCA
IIb
456 607 576 570 CDY
a
CDY
b
442 438 531 578 395
S1a
395
S1b
590 537 641 472 406
S1
511 425 413
a
413
b
557 594 436 490 534 450 444 481 520 446 617 568 487 572 640 492 565 441 461 463 445 452 YGATA
A10
YGATA
H4.1
462 GGAAT
1807
635
6043
Hammer
AustroHungary
PART
S7FKB
14 22 15 10 15 15 11 12 12 12 10 31 17 9 9 11 11 26 16 21 28 13 13 14 14 10 10 21 21 16 15 14 17 36 37 11 10 11 8 15 16 8 12 10 8 10 11 12 21 24 17 9 12 12 16 8 13 21 23 16 13 11 13 10 11 11 13
35782
Weissman
X
69GQ5
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 12 10 30 17 9 9 11 11 26 16 20 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 21 21 16 15 14 17 36 37 11 10
 
YHRDstudy*
MendozaArgentina
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 11 12 10 30 18 16 21 11 16 10 21
158135
Stearns
 
X
 
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 12 10 31 17 9 9 11 11 26 16 21 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 21 21 17 15 14 17 36 37 11 10
 
Heyman
Lithuania
?
SCX7J
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 12 10 30
N55331
Meyers
Lithuania
FULL
83TK3
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 12 10 31 17 9 9 11 11 26 16 21 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 21 21 17 15 14 17 36 37 11 10
89561
Rothstein
Belarus
PART
ZV2W5
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 12 10 30 18 9 9 11 11 26 16 21 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 21 21 17 15 14 17 35 37 11 10
 
YCC
Sample80
 
FULL
 
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 12 10 31 26 16 10
 
SorensonDB anonymous
Kashgar
China
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 12 10 29 17 9 9 11 11 26 15 21 29 13 13 14 14 10 21 22 15 11 10 13 16 14 13 22 29 12 10 21
 
YCC
Sample24
 
FULL
 
14 22 16 10 16 16 11 12 12 12 10 31 26 16 10
 
YHRD
Mestizo*
Antioquia
Colombia
X
 
14 22 16 10 15 16 11 12 10 31
 
ResearchStudy2*
Lebanon
(Maronite)
GENL
14 22 16 9 11 12 12 12 10 29 10
 
ResearchStudy2*
Lebanon
(Maronite)
GENL
 
14 22 16 10 11 12 11 12 10 29 10
 
YHRDsample*
Armenia
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 11 12 10 30
 
YHRDsample*
Tyrol Austria
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 11 12 10 30
 
YHRDsample*
CaubutArgnetina
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 11 12 10 30
 
YHRDsample*
MisionesArgentina
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 11 12 10 30
 
2 YHRD
samples*
Costa Rica
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 10 30 18 16 21 11 14 10
 
YHRDsample*
HispanicAmerican
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 10 30 18 16 21 11 14 10
 
YHRDsample*
Costa Rica
X
14 22 16 10 15 15 11 12 12 10 30 17 16 21 11 14 10
 
ResearchStudy2*
Lebanon
(Sunni)
GENL
 
14 22 16 10 11 12 11 12 10 28 10
 
ResearchStudy3*
2 samples
Cyprus
GENL
 
14 22 16 10 11 12 11 12 10 28 10


3. Men with YCA=20,21 and DYS389ii=30 and DYS393=14

                                                                                                                                     Marker designations in blue

Kit No. Surname Ancestral.origin
 
Haplo
Code
 
YSearch
Link
393 390 19
(394)
391 385
a
385
b
426 388 439 389
i
392 389
ii
458 459
a
459
b
455 454 447 437 448 449 464
a
464
b
464
c
464
d
464
e
464
f
460 GATA
H4
YCA
IIa
YCA
IIb
456 607 576 570 CDY
a
CDY
b
442 438 531 578 395
S1a
395
S1b
590 537 641 472 406
S1
511 425 413
a
413
b
557 594 436 490 534 450 444 481 520 446 617 568 487 572 640 492 565 441 461 463 445 452 YGATA
A10
YGATA
H4.1
462 GGAAT
1807
635
 72843
Moody
 
 X
 
14 22 15 10 14 16 11 12 12 12 10 30 18 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 28 13 13 14 14 10 10 20 21 14 15 17 20 38 39 12 10
 
YHRDsample*
BuenosAArgentina
 X
 
14 22 15 10 14 16 11 13 12 10 30 10
 
YHRDsample*
Bulgaria(Turk)
 X
 
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 10 30
 
YHRDsample*
AndaluciaSpain
 X
 
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 10 30
 
YHRDsample*
MadridSpain
 X
 
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 12 10 30 10
 
YHRDsample*
CaracasVenezuela
 X
 
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 12 10 30 10
 
2 YHRD
samples*
HispanicAmericans
 X
 
14 22 15 10 14 16 11 12 12 10 30 19 16 21 11 14 10 21
 
YHRDsample*
HispanicAmerican
 X
 
14 22 15 10 14 16 11 12 12 10 30 20 16 21 11 14 10 21
 15923
Moody
 England
FULL
CSJK6
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 12 12 10 30 18 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 28 13 13 14 14 10 10 20 21 14 15 17 21 38 39 12 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 12 9 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 14 8 13 21 20 17 13 11 13 10 11 11 13
28166 
Benedict
NorfolkEngl
X
N4UYA
14 22 15 10 16 17 11 12 11 12 10 30 16 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 20 21 15 15 15 18 37 38 11 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 11 10 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 15 8 13 21 22 15 13 11 12 10 11 11 13
39892
Benedict
NorfolkEngl
MUCH
5DRES
14 22 15 10 16 17 11 12 11 12 10 30 17 9 9 11 11 24 16 21 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 20 21 15 15 15 18 37 38 11 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 11 10 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 15 8 13 21 22 15 13 11 12 10 11 11 13
30304
Benedict
X
QCUNC
14 22 15 10 16 17 11 12 11 12 10 30 16 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 29 14 14 14 14 10 10 20 21 15 15 15 18 37 38 11 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 11 10 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 15 8 13 21 22 15 13 11 12 10 11 11 13
23462
Benedict
NorfolkEngl
FULL
84N8Q
14 22 15 10 16 17 11 12 11 12 10 30 16 9 9 11 11 25 16 21 28 13 13 14 14 10 10 20 21 15 15 15 18 37 38 11 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 11 10 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 15 8 13 21 22 15 13 11 12 10 11 11 13
N10891
Benedict
NorfolkEngl
 X
XYVYK
14 22 15 10 16 17 11 12 11 12 10 30 16 9 9 11 11 25 16 20 29 13 13 14 14 10 10 20 21 15 15 15 18 37 38 11 10
104075
Benedict
 
X
 
14 22 15 10 16 17 11 12 11 12 10 30
Benedict
 
?
EQZCK
14 22 15 10 16 17 11 12 11 12 10 30
 
ResearchStudy4*
 DamascusSyria
GENL
 
14 22 16 10 16 17 11 12 11 12 10 28 18 16
N35927
Manigault*
 
MUCH
 
14 22 15 10 15 15 11 12 13 13 10 30
N70680
SalinasMata*
Mexico
X
TJPSZ
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 12 12 10 30
136388
SalinasRamirez*
Mexico
X
9EMCY
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 12 12 10 30 19 9 9 11 11 24 16 21 28 13 13 14 14
Lastras*
Mexico
?
E28YJ
14 22 15 10 15 16 11 12 12 12 10 30
34185 
Gursel
Turkey
MUCH
TYB8D
14 22 15 10 16 20 11 12 12 13 10 30 17 9 9 11 11 24 15 20 28 13 13 13 14 10 10 20 21 15 15 15 18 36 38 11 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 12 11 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 15 8 13 21 22 16 13 12 13 10 11 12 12
127302 
Oner
Turkey(Greek)
MUCH
59MEX
14 22 15 10 16 17 11 12 13 13 10 31 16 9 9 12 11 24 15 19 31 13 13 14 14 10 10 20 21 15 15 15 18 35 37 11 10 11 8 15 16 8 11 10 8 12 10 12 21 22 14 10 12 12 15 8 13 22 22 15 13 11 13 10 11 11 11
 
Bayramukov*
s.w.Russia(Turkic)
?
ZZYVS
14 22 16 10 16 18 11 12 12 13 10 30
 
ResearchStudy3*
1 sample
Cyprus
GENL
 
14 22 16 10 11 12 12 13 10 29 10
 
YHRDsample
Abazins(Russia)
X
 
14 22 16 10 15 17 11 13 10 29
 
ResearchStudy
1 sample
Turkey
MANY
 
14 22 16 10 11 12 12 13 10 30
 

                                                      * An asterick behind a surname indicates that the person is only predicted part of this group and
                                                            lacks sufficient markers to confirm it.  Exceptions made for relatives of a confirmed member.


Haplogroup SNP Testing Codes
                Results not relevant to the men on this page are not listed
X - not tested 
? - unclear what testing was or was not done
GENL - tested only for M201, the SNP that characterizes plain G
PART - was found M201+ (G) and P15+ (G2a) but not tested further for subgroups pertinent to men on this page
MANY -  was found P16+ (G2a1), but test for P18 (G2a1a) was not then available
MUCH - was found P16+ (G2a1) and negative for P18 (G2a1a)
FULL - was found P16+ (G2a1) and P18+ (G2a1a)

Link to Haplogroup G Tree Structure